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Thread: Wolves to shoot or not to shoot.
07-18-2007, 08:34 AM #1
Wolves to shoot or not to shoot.
I know most of you on here are city folk and will not care or understand this.
Some will say they are an endangered species.
Those of us that raise livestock will say something different. They are a predator, plain and simple. If you have your livelihood threatened you may feel differently.
Having a farm and livestock I can understand the ranchers near Yellowstone’s anger, trying to raise livestock is hard enough, to keep them alive in ideal conditions.
Bring in a predator that kills for fun and knows no bonders that you can’t kill until it can be proven to have hurt your livestock is an outrage.
We don’t have a big problem here in Maine will wolves, yet. Coyotes are more of a problem now but with all the people here that own wolf hybrids, yes they are allowed here as pets. Problem is people don’t understand that this is a wild animal, the owners themselves are getting bitten by their own pets.
Then there are the ones that escape and just run wild.
Talk between yourselves.
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07-18-2007, 08:44 AM #2
That is a hard one, we don't want to total wipe out the Wolves but we sure do not need them taking the bread off our tables! Did you see the special on Discovery where the gut was living with them and studying them to try and better understand them and try and find a way to keep them away from livestock. He has the scientific comunity watching real close, he has found out more than anyone and has already helped several farmers with large Wolf population problems. Very interesting.Terry
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07-18-2007, 09:47 AM #3
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I used to work for a guy that trained police dogs on the side (he was the president of a kennel club and just ran a company until that club could support him).
Anyhow, one day someone asked him if he knew anything about wolf hybrids for guard dogs or whatever. Stay clear of that, you can't breed out the wolf in them, he said. That was the old mentality I guess. I guess the new mentaility it to try to find the balance between protecting farmers/ranchers interests and not decimating the wolf population at all. They still serve an interest in maintaining the ecology, just have to find ways to keep them away.
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07-18-2007, 10:04 AM #4
3 Words....Blam, Blam, Blam!
(Then the soft tickling of casings hitting the ground)
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07-18-2007, 10:20 AM #5
I am and always have been a hunter. I have shot my share of coyotes and small predators, but I have never shot a wolf. Supposedly, wolves don't exist in this area, but I can attest first hand that they do. We had a working cattle ranch about 100 miles south of Dallas back in the 80's and we had a family of wolves living on our property. We saw the mother quite a few times and heard the pups on occasion. They never took any of our cattle, so we left them alone. We also had a mountain lion on the same property. It would make our horses nervous at certain places around the ranch.
This past deer season, I sat in my stand on my deer lease and watched a bobcat walk around the area I was hunting for about 20 minutes. A deer walked up and ran the bobcat off. I didn't shoot the bobcat because I enjoyed watching it much better. About 3 weeks later, one of the other hunters walked up on the bobcat and it had a deer pinned to the ground. He yelled at the cat and it ran one way and the deer ran the other. I didn't think they would try to take a deer, just rabbits, etc. If I see it again, I will probably shoot it.Gary
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07-18-2007, 11:55 AM #6
i think if they are on your farm or you see them attack/chase livestock you should shoot them. just my 2centsMatt
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07-18-2007, 01:07 PM #7
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Hmm,I have firearms, but I was never much on sport hunting.My brother is the sport hunter,and I can understand it, but it isn't for me.
Now I pretty much try to avoid killing anything that doesn't try to harm me or mine.Now taking $$ out of my pocket would fall under the heading of harm.
The best solution would be for the folks who,like wolves,to pay the ranchers for their loss. There are programs like this, but I think they are probably too paperwork BS intensive,maybe require some sort of proof etc.Who wants to haul around rotting carcasses as proof??
The Biologists land mgn types claim they can make good estimates on livestock losses vs wolf population.Maybe some sort of yearly compensation -paid in advance based on projected losses+ money lost with those losses in mind would work.In the great scheme of things we aren't talking more than several million $/ per year.Now one more farm subsidy might seem "bad" but this really isn't much $$. The wolves kill waaaaaay more than just cattle sheep/calves. They kill-by weight- far more rodents or herbivores etc that can degrade the l ranching/farming landscape than they kill cattle.Yeah,I know wolves/coyotes aren't stupid,they go for the youngest/weakest, not some 1100 lb mean bull.
I'm not a big fan of predators that can kill kids, or adults.Folks should go armed when they are likely to run into bears/big cats.
All that being said,the biggest risk-even in the wild-is a human predator.The best reason to go armed. I don't give a %&$ about regulations-if I'm anywhere isolated,I'm armed.
There is probably a way to work both. High deer elk populations increase the likelyhood of disease spreading-especially that Elk wasting disease(a mad cow varient that might cross over to us)
07-18-2007, 07:53 PM #8
You are right there is a federal program to compensate farmer/ranchers who have livestock killed by wolves. And it is a lot of paperwork BS to get the money.
I have never even seen a wolf here on our property, but then we have 20 Great Pyrenees on guard with the goats so I don’t think even a pack of wolves would chance coming near our place.
I saw a news article this morning on TV and it was about the ranchers/farmers near/abutting Yellowstone National Park that are really having the most trouble. They are getting shall I say pissed about the whole situation. You see they can not shoot them unless they have attacked their livestock.
They can only get reimbursed for their losses if they can prove it was a wolf.
Problem is out there near Yellowstone they are range cattle, they are not in fenced in. so they may not even find the dead cattle, sheep, goats for days, weeks, months and can’t prove to the governments satisfaction in order to get the payment.
Me if I see anything worrying chaseing our livestock if the dogs don’t get it, my deer rifle will.
We have a small farm 25 acres fenced and cross fenced by me in cattle fence on cedar posts so it is not a big problem here.
We have more problems with the ground hogs, jack rabbits and the like ruining my wife’s garden. Although we have had a bear try to get into the fenced in pens.
So you can see how I can be for the ranchers being allowed to kill them.
07-19-2007, 11:16 AM #9
fiero do you remember about 5 or 6 months ago when many national news stations reported on a "beast" that was terrorizing dogs and such in maine (cant remeber where) when they killed it didnt it turn out to be a wolf hybrid?Jeff - Maine
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07-19-2007, 08:52 PM #10
The guy one town over who has a lift in his garage, runs a repair shop. Has 2 hybrids who I refuse to turn my back on. I have known him and the wolves for over 6 years, yet still don’t trust them.
As far as the hybrids getting loose or being let free by their owners, it happens a lot up here. They find that the wolf is to aggressive and they just let them free into the wild. That causes problems for the farmers and ranchers up here.
You see we are not allowed to shot these things because they are on the endangered species list.
So most farmers/ranchers here follow the three S’s
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