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Thread: Black bear
08-15-2012, 08:35 PM #1
Alright guys I have made my final decision on getting the black bear traditional tune and I had a couple questions/opinions. One of the options deals with torque management and to be honest I am somewhat unsure about this. What does it do exactly and what have others gone with? Also one more quick question I am having a hard time deciding on the octane. I usually just use 87 but if the performance difference is good enough I could go for 89.
08-16-2012, 08:18 AM #2
Torque management is used to dampen the response time to throttle requests. This is done to protect the transmission and drive train from significant torque pressures resulting from immediate response when you stomp the pedal. The dampening basically can retard the response time up to 4 seconds before full power is sent through to the rear wheels. This feature protects the drive train at the expense of immediate access to power and torque.
Torque is essentially a measure of rotational force. The more torque an engine produces the more rotational force. Basically, when you stomp your gas pedal, with torque management the power output is ramped up to full, rather than immediately transferred.
Removing all of torque management is not recommended if you have a stock transmission, as the transmission is usually the weak point in GM vehicles. Transmission upgrades or "Fully built" transmissions are capable of handling all the torque transfer immediately without potentially damaging components.
All that being said, it is generally considered "safe" to remove a portion of the torque management. There are a variety of recommendations, though 20%-40% is common, and some performance solutions will even recommend up to 70%-75% on some stock transmissions. Whatever you end up choosing, even if it's a small amount, you'll note an immediate change in the "feel of power" in your vehicle when you stomp that gas pedal. Because more power is being immediately transferred to the wheels, you're basically unlocking the potential of your rig.
As for the octane rated tunes, higher octanes enable the tune to generate more horsepower and torque. Unless your goal is to squeeze every bit of power/torque out of your rig, an 87 octane tune will produce very similar results (as most of the difference will be only noted at high RPMs, which is not where most people drive!).
-Skippy2006 Vortec Max 1500
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08-16-2012, 12:10 PM #3
Okay thanks alot for that break down of torque management. I'll probably go with 20-40 to make sure and not do anything to my transmission. Yeah I would prefer the lower level octane cause the 6.0L doesn't have high mpg's.
08-16-2012, 01:36 PM #4
Unless you're increasing compression ratio (or boosting), you shouldn't have any need to run higher octane. I'm not sure exactly what the tune does for running the 89 octane, but most likely it leans out the fuel map a bit, as otherwise you're just wasting fuel and causing excessive wear to the catalytic converter, as a complete burn would be less likely.
08-16-2012, 01:47 PM #5
You mention you have the 6.0L engine. There are two offered in the Silverado line. Is this the 6.0L engine that is found in the 2500, or is this the "Vortec Max" package 6.0L engine. I ask, because the Vortec Max package engine (the engine code is LQ9, or vin code N) is a higher compression engine, and actually will run very very well on an 89 octane tune (owner's manual actually recommends premium, but with a tune, you get more with less octane, so to speak).
I highly suspect you have the standard 6.0L engine (producing about 325HP) but wanted to double check. And Dobey is definitely correct about higher octane tunes leaning out the mixture, but that can be done to some degree at 87 octane. The trick is to make it possible to run 87 octane without making it too lean (which actually makes it run very hot, burning things, even though you get better MPG). Higher Octane tunes are useful for producing more HP and torque, but as dobey suggests, there's a cost.
08-16-2012, 03:46 PM #6
08-16-2012, 03:58 PM #7
sorry about that its a sierra 2500 not the vortec max. I don't want it to run too lean and cause any damage all I was looking for was to wake up the engine
08-16-2012, 07:30 PM #8
id say go big or go home, get a 91 tune, have them remove the recommend amount of torque management. then go from there. to be honest the price u pay for 87 vs 91 ull make it up with the mpg gain and ull have more power.2004 gmc sierra ext z71 5.3
KB racing hot pipes 3.5" : 76mm turbo: 4l80e : Circle-d 2b multi disk :Walbro 400 : Racetronix Hotwire kit : TB coolant bypass : Nelson 91 Pcm : Tr 220 Cam : Brian Tooley double springs kit : Ls7 Lifters : Stage 3 heads : Custom Intake Manifold :80lb Injectors : Ported TB : 40k tranny cooler: Plx dm-100 gauge: Auto meter fuel and boost gauge:
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Future mods... Detriot tru-trac, deviels own stage 2 meth kit, MORE BOOST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08-16-2012, 08:13 PM #9
The price difference between the RON levels isn't substantial, but it's a waste of money if you're not actually burning all the fuel (and you won't be with stock compression ratio), and will cause excessive wear on the cat (as it has to burn all the unburned fuel for you). You'll more likely just end up with problems sooner rather than later.
But if you're going to spend the money for the tune, at least also get some decent bolt ons to make the tune worth it. CAI, headers, cat-back, and maybe a cam if you want to go that far. Replacing the balancer mounted fan with electric fans will help as well.
08-16-2012, 08:41 PM #10
i agree with the bolt on's as far as the other stuff..... how do u figure? high octane burns cleaner and more efficient. why do new Mercedes and beamers run only on 91 octane im not going to get into another dead end conversation i just know what works for alot of guys running 13 second truck. heck im getting 22 mpg with my set up and can beat on camaros and the new stangs. the tunes the most critical part of the whole equation with out it your very limited.
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