The Most American car

Discussion in 'The Coffee Shop ~ Chit Chat' started by tbplus10, Jul 28, 2012.

  1. tbplus10

    tbplus10 Super Moderator Staff Member

    The list of the most American built cars is out, GM has 3 spots in the top 10 but doesnt show up until #6, Ford shows up at #2, Toyota has 3 top 10 spots and shows up at #1, Honda twice at #3 and #5, and Jeep at #8.

    1. Toyota Camry
    Georgetown, Ky.; Lafayette, Ind.

    2. Ford F-150
    Dearborn, Mich.; Claycomo, Mo.

    3. Honda Accord
    Marysville, Ohio

    4. Toyota Sienna
    Princeton, Ind.

    5. Honda Pilot
    Lincoln, Ala.

    6. Chevrolet Traverse
    Lansing, Mich.

    7. Toyota Tundra
    San Antonio, Tex.

    8. Jeep Liberty
    Toledo, Ohio

    9. GMC Acadia
    Lansing, Mich.

    10. Buick Enclave
    Lansing, Mich.
  2. Als09Sierra

    Als09Sierra New Member

    Tim,

    Thanks for posting this Tim. I assume what determined the "most American" designation is where they're assembled. I suppose that's a good sign for our economy, but what does it say about the cars people buy and the reason they buy them? Would you buy any of the vehicles on this list?
  3. KyleZ71

    KyleZ71 New Member

    Can you supply any of your resources for this list? Im not trying to sound like a jerk I'd just like to read the whole article.
  4. Enkeiavalanche

    Enkeiavalanche Moderator

  5. KyleZ71

    KyleZ71 New Member

    Thanks man. Now I got some reading to do
  6. tbplus10

    tbplus10 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Yea Yahoo Autos.

    American-Made Index recognizes cars that are built here,
    have a high percentage of domestic parts,
    and are bought in large numbers by American consumers

    What bothers me is the big three should not be getting beat on a list like this, their on there home field and should be leading this pack.
    Dont know if you ever read Automotive buisness news much but they had an article a few weeks ago how Toyota America pays American assembly line workers half of what the big three pay, the benefits are equal i.e. medical, dental, retirement, Toyota America workers spend 32% less time layed off or on down time, their average annual take home pay is 25% higher, and their end product has consistantly rated higher quality by consumers.
    One thing that helps Toyota America is they have no unions, this is by employee choice.
    Maybe it's time for management and employee's at the big three to take a hard look and see whats going on, why Toyota America can do the job in the U.S. pay a higher tax on the products they do import, but in the end make a larger profit share and get better ratings.

    Most Japanese companies, Toyota included will credit a lot of their success to Dr Demming, if your ever in the mood for heavy reading on theorys and management google "Dr Demming" specifically "Post war Japan", this was the man that changed Japans way of doing buisness at home and abroad. The U.S. Navy uses Dr Demmings theorys for their advancement and management programs, the success rate since implementing them has tripled.
  7. tbplus10

    tbplus10 Super Moderator Staff Member

    While we may not favor the vehicles on this list it's obvious there is a part of the public that favors them, and I hate to admit it but Toyota and Honda have gone to great lengths to show it's possible to build a quality vehicle in America that the public will buy.
    I presently own a 1999 Toyota truck thats outlasted 2 other GM trucks, 2000, 2003, doing the same if not harder jobs as them even though they were both 3/4tons and its a 1/2ton. You dont have to like or buy their autos but the Japanese auto manufactures have got something going for them otherwise they wouldnt have the success theyve been carrying for a few years.
    When you take away the "built in America" tag from domestic auto manufacturers it doesnt leave the consumer much confidence in that manufacturer, especially since foreign auto manufacturers have been getting good quality ratings for years, what incentive is left for an American consumer to buy a supposedly American auto?
  8. aloxdaddy99

    aloxdaddy99 New Member

    Saturn used the Japanese model when they first started out. So they were able to make lower priced cars with quality. Even though they fell under the GM umbrella it was not advertised that way. Also if my memory serves me correctly they weren't part of the UAW. Which means they were bringing home more of their hard earned money. I was hoping after the bailout that the UAW would get busted. Of course that didn't happen. This thread could easily turn into a union bashing thread which to me is a big part of the issues with the big 3.
    The only car listed in that top 10 list I would own/drive is the GMC Acadia. My wife and I looked into the Saturn Outlook which is the Saturn version of the Acadia when we bought the Vue. The Acadia is an option when she wants a new ride.
  9. tbplus10

    tbplus10 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Yea it could easily turn into bash the unions.
    Management at these particular auto manufacturers shares blame too though.
    And to be fair to unions they did have a good purpose in the begining, when the U.S. govt. wasnt looking out at all for the working class and allowing the captains of industry to exploit the workers. Govt. oversite has come a long way and it leaves the debate open if unions are needed anymore or not.
    But the fact remains there are foriegn companies showing us on our shores it can be done better, we need to take notes. Probably some of the biggest problems with American companies is they invest to heavily in upper management so much so that senior V.P.'s are stepping on each other and they overpay senior management. But thats not something we'll solve here, in the end list's like this are just another way of voting because come Monday morning somebodies gonna be out of an office since they didnt make a projected goal, the first mistake the company will make is not honestly reviewing to see if that position is really needed.

    Yea Saturn used the model but along the way they got greedy and tried to project profit margin ahead of quality manufacturing. Stick to the basics and dont get greedy, I'm not saying it works every time but people will continue to buy a quality product even if the price goes up a little, but that price increase has to be within reason or they'll walk for a better deal even if they loose a little quality.
  10. aloxdaddy99

    aloxdaddy99 New Member

    The question on whether unions are still needed id something I have wondered for a long time. And the main argument against them is as you stated the gov't agencies that are in place to look out for our well being. I thought the down fall for the Saturn brand was that GM saw how profitable they were and tried to "fix" it. But either way it is a sad statement to the big three when they are out sold in their back yard.
  11. donyms

    donyms New Member

    I understand the frustration of the way things have been in the auto industry for years but myself I know that what is most important in the long run is to buy from an American company. Companies go into business for a profit so you have to consider that if you buy a Toyota or a Honda, where is the profit going? The biggest benefit is going to Japan or some other country. Myself, I will support my country 100% and only buy vehicles in which the profits are supporting an American company. I am very patriotic and I will support my country to the fullest extent until there is no country left and that will happen eventually if people continue to look for excuses to buy from other counties and not America. This country was founded and built by hardline patriots and that is what it is going to take to save it.
  12. tbplus10

    tbplus10 Super Moderator Staff Member

    I know what your saying but take a look at the major behind the scenes share holders at the big three, their all foreign investors, so the money is still going out of the U.S. And many of the foreign manufacturers have U.S. investors bringing money back to the U.S. from their investments, in the global economy we have now the best interest of the U.S. isnt where the profit ends up, because the investors are still taxed when the money leaves or enters the U.S., it's in the gross domestic product, how much were producing in house no matter what brand name it's under because that keeps U.S. workers moving and how much were selling no matter if it's at home or overseas, remember leaving the country items are still hit with an export tax too.
    Not many "American companies" are American anymore, the face they put up front is very different than the legal ownership papers on file, but the one benefit in American companies is where the wage of the employees end up, and thats normally in the U.S. which is what counts to us in the end.
  13. SupplySgt

    SupplySgt New Member

    I'm surprised Nissan wasn't on that list with the Altima (I think it was the best selling Sedan in the US last quarter), because most of their suppliers are within a 50 mile radius of their assembly plant in Smyrna. In fact, they had a much easier time of dealing with the tsunami in Japan because there were fewer critical parts that were made in Japan than Toyota or Honda. The other two lost far more production numbers over that than Nissan did. I work for one of their suppliers building seats for the Altima (my plant also builds truck seats). I will say though that Nissan has done a lot more for Tennessee (especially by directly and indirectly employing a huge % of the workforce here) than any of the Big 3 ever have. In fact, their North American headquarters is about 30 minutes away in Franklin, TN so they make up a good portion of the white collar workforce in the area as well.

    The way I see it is what good does it do for the profits to go back to the US if they aren't employing as many Americans? Tim makes a great point about the investors as well. I'd be interested to see how many each of the car makers employ in the US. I imagine Toyota and Nissan are both near the top, and I wouldn't be surprised if they are the top two.
  14. Coach24

    Coach24 New Member

    Agreed Sarge. But I would like to see the numbers year by year. Showing how the foreigners are building more stable employment while the big three seem to be employing more folks outside our fine country.
    Did Penske kill the Saturn or is he still going to get production going? Anyone hear?
  15. aloxdaddy99

    aloxdaddy99 New Member

    Coach I have heard the Penske thing is dead. He wanted to continue to produce the cars at the Saturn factory in TN as part of the deal. I had read somewhere that the production line that had made the Vue had already began to transition to producing the Cadillac SUV that looks like a Vue.
    It would be nice if in these list's they combined the Silverado/Sierra sales and production together. Yes they are different I know! I think that was a part of the failure that GM had. The same car with different emblems. Like the Saturn Outlook and the GMC Acadia.
  16. Coach24

    Coach24 New Member

    Thanks for the info. I agree with the wasted personnel and streamlining to make one singular great line of trucks. I believe cost savings and quality are compromised by having 2 of everything , most being the same parts. Just shipped to different warehouses.
    I would like to see a re-emergence of Class 5-6 trucks from GM or sell the information to someone like Penske and maintain contracts with American non-union companies to keep costs in line.
  17. AlpacaSteve

    AlpacaSteve New Member

    If only Chevy and Ford would put some style back in their products. The HHR was a start, then they killed it. The Solstice/Sky platform was good but they killed it... The F-150 is on there, but it's become a pseudo-luxury vehicle that is more show than go. It may be a while before I buy another vehicle.

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