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Whats wrong here?

Discussion in 'Audio, Video & Gadget Tech' started by no0b123, Oct 17, 2008.

  1. no0b123

    no0b123 Rockstar ROTM Winner 100 Posts

    My current setup:
    4 JL Audio speakers (Two TR650-CXi Coaxials, Two TR400-CXi Coaxials)
    Sony Deck 50x4
    Two 10" Alpine SWE-1042 subs
    One MTX 300XD Mono Amp powering both subs

    Problem: Subwoofer volume contained within the cab of the truck, and the speakers aren't really loud. Just loud.

    I know of two faults, the subwoofer boxes are sealed and 6 years old. Secondly, I think the subs are underpowered considering I want it insanely loud (so you can actually hear the subs thump outside the truck). My budget is $250 dollars.

    Would you consider another MTX 300XD amp so each sub gets its own amp, or a huge 1000W amp to power both subs and ditch the MTX 300XD? Is the Sony deck sufficient for all 4 JL Audio mids? I am for sure getting ported boxes. The subs and amp is mounted underneath the bench seat in the back.
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2008
  2. 5.7guy

    5.7guy New Member

    with my truck being a single cab i didnt have room for this but, i would think start off with a new box. they have some awesome pro/pro bass box's at a local audio store(which im sure you can order from anywhere). i was talking to a guy in there that had one and he let me listen to his car, it was ridiculous. also if you talk to most Kicker seller's most will always agree if you want it extremely loud go with a ported box.

    i bought the same speakers / amp from a cousin (2x kicker 12" with a rocksford 450w) i thought they would rock my little single cab but i put them in a sealed box. in my cousins he had a huge ported box. would make a can bounce if you set it on top of the cab. (a half full can i learnt the hard way :/ spilt all over me) kinda funny. they make your ear drums rattle in one box and just a firm thump in another. odd how that works

    most audio stores will build a custom box for around 200$-300
  3. Springthing

    Springthing Epic Member 5+ Years 1000 Posts

    Well, here's what I'm seeing... you have two subs that are...250w? A little more than that? Your amp is 300w powering both subs. I'm thinking you'd need another amp so each amp can power each sub OR a stronger amp to power both subs, making sure the amp output is able to handle both subs. If I'm not mistaken... if you have an amp that's not powerful enough to push power into your total subs you'll get sub-optimal sound and sub-optimal volume - alternately if you have too powerful of an amp you'll get sub-optimal sound and enough power to blow the subs out.

    As always, I'm sure someone that's more knowledgeable will post and be able to help you a little more.
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  4. no0b123

    no0b123 Rockstar ROTM Winner 100 Posts

    Would you say the subs I have now are good? And is it possible to power both subs and my 4 speakers through one amp? I guess my subs are really underpowered. Thanks for the replys.

    Edit: What does this mean
    * Power Handling Capacity (Peak) : 750W
    * Power Handling Capacity (RMS) : 250W

    250w is the minimum to power these subs?
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2008
  5. Springthing

    Springthing Epic Member 5+ Years 1000 Posts

    In general RMS is an average level and peak is the most the speakers can go to. I *believe* that the more you bump sound up towards the peak level pas RMS l 1) the crappier it's going to sound; 2) chances are better that you'll blow the subs/speakers.

    Around 250W is what you want to put those subs through, anything more or less than that will lessen the sound quality/level.

    I am by no means an expert on this stuff and I could well be giving you the wrong information, but here is what I DO know:

    Much like an entire vehicle, a sound system has a certain order or parts, and a certain 'match'. Not only that, but you have total crap quality ------------> right to great quality.

    A crappy component, whatever it is, rated at 500w, may only actually act as a 65w component and sound like a a fart in a tin can where a good quality 500w component may sound like you are in an amphitheater listen to the new york philharmonic orchestra.

    For great quality you need a good power source and wires, good head unit, good wiring good cross-overs, good amp, speakers, subs, capacitor, etc etc...

    Unfortunately this is one those situation where you get what you pay for. As always, the problem is finding the price that's the true price and not the over-inflated retailers price.

    Your particular application... I have no idea about!

    Let me go see if I can find a site I found some time ago to explain some of this stuff a little better.. makes for great bathroom reading.

    Ok, found it and will pm you the link. Good site that has sample systems, explains how the components work together, how they should be installed, etc etc. Will also send another that explains all the different components individually in detail.

    Hope those help, and hope it gets your particular system whipped into shape!

    Toodles,
  6. MWright936

    MWright936 Epic Member 5+ Years 1000 Posts

    I'll start by saying I'm no expert either. From what I know, I would suggest a 2-channel amp that will push around 250W RMS per channel. To boost power to your component speakers, get a 4-channel amp that pushes around the same RMS watts as your speakers.

    I've learned quite a bit from Crutchfield.com. Click on the "Learn" tab and find the subject you are interested in. Hope that helps!
  7. no0b123

    no0b123 Rockstar ROTM Winner 100 Posts

    Looks like I'll get another mtx 300xd amp so its one amp per subs. I'll leave the speakers running off the Sony deck then.

    What is/are crossovers?
  8. MWright936

    MWright936 Epic Member 5+ Years 1000 Posts

    Crossovers are used when you have component speakers with separate tweeters and woofers. They are wired in-line with the speakers and send the high frequency sound to the tweeters and the lower frequency sound to the woofers. I'm sure it's more complex than that, but that's what I've gathered from my research.
  9. zippy

    zippy Rockstar 100 Posts

    MWright936's right about the applications of crossovers, but they aren't limited to two ranges. Three-way crossover netwroks (hi, mid-range and low) are common, also. The mid range fills-in the typical low spot between the hi and low pass filters.

    [SIZE=-2]Typical 3-way frequencies:[/SIZE]
    [​IMG]
    And, with trucks there's a another type of crossover. :whistle:
    [​IMG]
  10. ChevyFan

    ChevyFan Administrator Staff Member 5+ Years 5000 Posts

    I found this old explaination on the web.


    [SIZE=+2]RMS AND PEAK TO PEAK VOLTAGES[/SIZE]

    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]If someone measures the value of the AC voltage coming out of a transformer using an oscilloscope and says it is 20 volts peak to peak and we use a voltmeter to confirm this we will find that the meter reads only 7.07 volts.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]This is because the scope measures peak to peak values and the meter measures RMS values.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]In figure 1 the 'scope displays the peak value. The peak to peak voltage is twice this.[/FONT]

    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]For example if the peak is 10 volts then the peak to peak is 20 volts.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]When using a meter to measure the same AC voltage a different value is obtained. This is because, as we said, meters measure RMS values.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]A Root Mean Square (RMS) voltage gives the same heating effect as a DC voltage of the same value.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]See figures 2 and 3. Both thermometers show the same temperature when the resistors are heated by the current passing through them.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]RMS values can be converted to peak to peak values and vice-versa.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]RMS values times 1.414 equals the Peak value.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Peak to Peak is twice this.[/FONT]

    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]7.07 volts RMS times 1.414 and then doubled is 20 volts, the Peak to Peak value.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Peak values times 0.707 gives the RMS value.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Don't forget that Peak is half the Peak to Peak.[/FONT]


    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]20 volts Peak to Peak is 10 volts Peak. 10 volts Peak times 0.707 equals 7.07 volts RMS.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The Mains supply voltage in the UK is 230 volts RMS.[/FONT]

    [​IMG]
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